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Post by Corey Black on Jan 28, 2019 15:31:17 GMT -5
Remember that thing about TEAMWORK I mentioned last week?
Alright let's extend that to KAYFABE and RESPECT.
Kayfabe, if you're unaware, is the general following of storylines. We know this shit's all fake, but you're supposed to be playing a character in a world. A lot of you sure as shit aren't. And for that, I'm going to instruct RPS start getting docked 'points' which is arbitrary because we don't use a point system, but ya'll mofukkas shootin' the shit OOC about to start losing. This is a game, an escape, it's not a dick showing contest. From now on every penis out there is the same size - 4 inches. Top to bottom, let's reign it in and get back to the core fun of writing.
Secondly, respect. Sure, stuff comes up. I used to miss writing RPs constantly. As soon as I realized how that just generally wastes everyone's time, I stopped and didn't miss another week. So, I think we should actually enforce Seth's old rule of miss a week, alright, shoot us a good reason and we'll turn a blind eye. Two weeks? Off the roster, you can redo your app if you want but you better write because third time? Don't need ya. Bye. We're bare bones enough as it is, losing people is fucking disastrous, but if you don't have time to RP, we don't have time to write your match or facilitate storylines and pretend titles.
For the most part everyone's doing pretty good, but damn if shit doesn't pile up fast, ya know? Let's just step back and realize what we have here, and the fact that it's like three dudes that have next to no time to give you this avenue.
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Post by Scott Slayer on Jan 28, 2019 16:18:08 GMT -5
Damn boss, didn’t think you had it you. I’ll make sure to give everything my best effort from now on.
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Post by Corey Black on Jan 28, 2019 16:20:12 GMT -5
Damn boss, didn’t think you had it you. I’ll make sure to give everything my best effort from now on. That's really all I ask, haha. We're pretty understanding most of the time but with the way cards are going lately, we have to do something. |
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Post by Teo Blaze on Jan 28, 2019 16:27:15 GMT -5
I just want to step in here to thank all the match writers and admins for doing such an awesome job getting shows out week after week. I know I have the easy part and wouldn't want to do what they have to for any amount of money.
With that said I also understand that we have kept the lines as far as kayfabe goes pretty blurred. Think about it, we have a hobby where we take turns laying down sick burns at each other.
I am not sure who anyone is referring to but I would like to step in here and say that anything that Teo says, regardless of how harsh it may seem, is completely and one hundred percent in-character, and that if anyone EVER thinks that I have crossed a line to feel free to let me know via PM or any other message.
I do think however that some of Corey's comments may come a place of (well deserved) frustration. Speaking as someone who is legitimately busy and just focuses on RPing every week...I understand that these shows can seem like trying to herd cats sometimes. With that said, I think the key word we need to work on might not be "respect" as I try to give writers the benefit of the doubt when they are unable to RP, but it's instead what we might need to work on is "Transparency" and "Openness" with each other.
Tear down those walls that competition brings, ya know?
If you think that your ability to conistently RP might be harmed, let the people in charge know so that they can book you accordingly. Don't be afraid to let them know about creative trouble or even if work schedules are getting bad.
And I've said it again and again and again, and I'm going to keep saying it till it changes, start using the damn feedback board more. This to me is one of our biggest sins, myself wholly included. You know what makes people want to write week-in and week-out, ESPECIALLY when they're losing hard-fought matches? It's knowing someone out there actually took the time to read it freely and by choice. Knowing that people are fans of their characters. Knowing that someone out there does care. We should be reading each other's work more not only to help ourselves write, but because it keeps people going. Throw out a like on some RPs, create a thread highlighting a particular one. Don't just throw shade, throw sunshine (no pun intended). I can't speak for everyone, but if I'm losing high profile matches, that kills me. If nobody is there to remind me that I still did fine, then it just makes it worse.
Like I opened by saying, I think everyone in charge is doing a phenomenal job keeping the show going. I know that it can be frustrating running this place and I'm sorry for any role I have played in contributing to the frustration involved here...but I do think there are solutions that can be reached amicably without threatening people's characters or threatening to cut people from the roster.
The problems that have been raised are worth discussing, but I worry that discussing them openly can be difficult since the people involved have stakes in the outcome of the argument, ya know?
My two cents.
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Post by Noble Savage on Jan 28, 2019 16:45:47 GMT -5
My life has been very frantic for the last two months and I'm still amazed that I've managed to roleplay at all, but I refuse to ever no-show because I respect this place too much. With that said, I fully understand those who no-show because life gets in the way and believe me I do not want to get into personal details but there have been insane changes to my personal life that have made it nearly impossible to sit at my computer. Aside from that I'd like to second Teo Blaze in his "if I cross the line" statement. If I mess up, just have management let me know directly. I would hate for one of these posts to actually be directed at me one day. I am not sure who anyone is referring to but I would like to step in here and say that anything that Teo says, regardless of how harsh it may seem, is completely and one hundred percent in-character, and that if anyone EVER thinks that I have crossed a line to feel free to let me know via PM or any other message. . I was also mesin around trying to create new account here and accidentally replied with that one lol I deleted it and replied again so that people know I'm me lol |
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Post by Corey Black on Jan 28, 2019 16:50:35 GMT -5
Ayyy u rite
I'm the last person to whine about people not writing an RP any given week, but at the same time, I have to aim to discourage that. It's a shitty place to be in for sure. Stuff comes up, I feel it. But when stuff comes up more than not maybe it's time to evaluate why anyone's spending their time on maintaining for someone who isn't putting in the time.
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Post by Corey Black on Jan 28, 2019 16:55:53 GMT -5
And REALLY it's not even a problem at this point. It's more trying to prevent a problem.
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Post by Zombie DankMorris on Jan 28, 2019 16:56:21 GMT -5
Damn boss, didn’t think you had it you. I’ll make sure to give everything my best effort from now on. You don't know the old Corey black. |
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Post by Corey Black on Jan 28, 2019 16:59:17 GMT -5
Damn boss, didn’t think you had it you. I’ll make sure to give everything my best effort from now on. You don't know the old Corey black. Ain't that the truth, lol. But he died. I hope. |
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Post by Teo Blaze on Jan 28, 2019 17:02:58 GMT -5
Ayyy u rite I'm the last person to whine about people not writing an RP any given week, but at the same time, I have to aim to discourage that. It's a shitty place to be in for sure. Stuff comes up, I feel it. But when stuff comes up more than not maybe it's time to evaluate why anyone's spending their time on maintaining for someone who isn't putting in the time. It truly is a thankless job, no doubt. I of all people have no room to talk, since I have in the past gone on sprees of frustration and depression with my own character. But...with that said the fact that I was constantly put back in the ball game is what finally motivated me to shake things up a bit. Almost every time I have no-showed has been due to being stuck in a creative rut, and changing things up has been my way of coping with that, for better or worse lol. I do NOT want to speak for anyone by saying this, but I do genuinely think that no-shows come from two places, out of character responsibility (no real solution) and lack of motivation. However! Looking at the genuine talent we have here, and the fact that every week we practically write a short novel between every RP, I do not think the motivation comes from a place of uncaring. I think it honestly stems mostly from a place of frustration or even a perceived feeling of apathy. The results can come across as very binary. "You won" or "You lost". I'm not saying that every single Roleplay needs a private message saying how great it is, nor should people expect that, but I honestly feel that one of the first steps towards bringing back the enthusiasm each week is by communication and feedback. One option might be to bring back the "Of the Week" awards, which have been unofficially retired. I know for a fact that seeing my name up on that list drove me to write regardless of if it was a dumb tag match or not. Another option might be to just promote more discussion among the group. Have an official discord channel or something and actually pin a thread with all the links so we can get in touch with each other and actually talk about our characters. Have a place where people can go so that we can support each other or just talk about nonsense. Hell, we could have a room where we talk about WWE pay-per-views (while OBVIOUSLY watching them individually via legal means, don't shoot me Vince's robots.) I do think that the biggest way to address these issues though is communication. We are all here putting in genuinely hard work freely and by choice, after all, and I can tell you the reason I do it every week is because I have been lucky enough to have an audience get invested in a story that I've been telling, and that is something I would never trade, no matter how many times I no-show. I will always come back as long as I know that there's someone listening. Again, just my take on things. |
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Post by Corey Black on Jan 28, 2019 17:06:15 GMT -5
Yeah alright fuck, I should amend this. Clearly I came off like a Nazi. Totally not my intention. I'm not even frustrated, really, but trying to work to get everyone on the same page so we can right the ship. Maybe I'm just trying not to seem frustrated, I dunno. Obviously the no RP weekly stuff came from a preventative idea as opposed to blatant call-out, it's a non-issue as of press time. I'll come out and call ya out if ya need it. Nobody needed it. RPs are coming in later and later though, so that kinda scared me into it, I think. It's a good rule though. Seth never enforced it, I tried telling him a billion times it would work but.. nope. Haha.
The OOC stuff I've seen sprinkled among a lot of you around here, which has been an issue for like a decade at this point, but with the advent of Action Wrestling and some animosity there, it's getting too heavy to ignore. Mainly Twitter, sometimes RPs, but we're all better than OOC potshots for the sake of it.
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Post by Odin Balfore on Jan 28, 2019 17:08:43 GMT -5
Teo.. we're a forum community. Why would we need other forms of communication? Not that it's bad but it'll just be another thing that causes kliqs. Like last time
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Post by Teo Blaze on Jan 28, 2019 17:18:36 GMT -5
Teo.. we're a forum community. Why would we need other forms of communication? Not that it's bad but it'll just be another thing that causes kliqs. Like last time Just discussing options. In my head it would just be an official way to get to know each other or meet that is freely shown to be able to discuss things without the need for PM's or to just get to know each other in a way that doesn't involve laying down the aforementioned sick burns. Any kliq-ish behavior is certainly a risk, but I feel like that is a risk regardless of the channel. My thought in emphasizing a meeting room or anything similar would be to make the place feel less closed off and let us meet the people actually piloting these characters. We're actually a pretty cool group of dudes and ladies after all. I agree with you though that it could turn sour, but I don't see a way to avoid that, honestly, without some kind of assurance from everyone involved that they will not turn it into a tool of politics. I don't have an answer for you in the latter case. I've always tried to avoid kliqs even as a stable. (We're intentionally using the WWE kliq spelling, right? because of the negative connotation often associated with that group?) |
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Post by Corey Black on Jan 28, 2019 17:24:54 GMT -5
Chats are quite notorious. Like.. too notorious, lol. Price and I both bailed on chats a long while ago.
We're all real people with real issues, WCF is like 7th on my list of shit I worry about in a day. I have the problem where I've been associated with WCF longer than Slayer has been alive, and that's fucking bonkers to me, haha. We're in a great place social-wise, little to no problems that aren't easily hammered out that I know of, anyway. Seemingly no interfed fighting or anything. Maybe we could do a chat of some kind and open it up. I'll check out some options.
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Post by Odin Balfore on Jan 28, 2019 17:26:58 GMT -5
Teo.. we're a forum community. Why would we need other forms of communication? Not that it's bad but it'll just be another thing that causes kliqs. Like last time Just discussing options. In my head it would just be an official way to get to know each other or meet that is freely shown to be able to discuss things without the need for PM's or to just get to know each other in a way that doesn't involve laying down the aforementioned sick burns. Any kliq-ish behavior is certainly a risk, but I feel like that is a risk regardless of the channel. My thought in emphasizing a meeting room or anything similar would be to make the place feel less closed off and let us meet the people actually piloting these characters. We're actually a pretty cool group of dudes and ladies after all. I agree with you though that it could turn sour, but I don't see a way to avoid that, honestly, without some kind of assurance from everyone involved that they will not turn it into a tool of politics. I don't have an answer for you in the latter case. I've always tried to avoid kliqs even as a stable. (We're intentionally using the WWE kliq spelling, right? because of the negative connotation often associated with that group?) We did that before with discords, tiny chat, fb.. and it turned into a mess. Granted it's not the same wcf, but idk, I guess ppl being hurt over invites can't be avoided? Idk, I just don't want a good idea to sour into bad things |
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Post by Vincent Augustine on Jan 28, 2019 19:18:42 GMT -5
I've been playing this game for a long damn ass time, and I can say that I have never seen a chat that didn't at some point go marching south like Sherman. They always started off great and then at some point devolved into nothing more than a mess of people getting all clickish and making life miserable for others. I have sent out a lot of PM's to people in this fed over my year and to be honest have not gotten a whole hell of a lot of responses, sure a chat might help that, but the reality is if people don't want to communicate they are not going to communicate. I mean there is the scroll bar at the bottom of the page and that seems to work well for most of us, and there is always the PM method as well. I guess what I am saying is if good ideas or conversations are meant to be had there are plenty of way for us in this fed to get it done.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2019 23:59:46 GMT -5
Yeah alright fuck, I should amend this. Clearly I came off like a Nazi. Totally not my intention. I'm not even frustrated, really, but trying to work to get everyone on the same page so we can right the ship. Maybe I'm just trying not to seem frustrated, I dunno. Obviously the no RP weekly stuff came from a preventative idea as opposed to blatant call-out, it's a non-issue as of press time. I'll come out and call ya out if ya need it. Nobody needed it. RPs are coming in later and later though, so that kinda scared me into it, I think. It's a good rule though. Seth never enforced it, I tried telling him a billion times it would work but.. nope. Haha. The OOC stuff I've seen sprinkled among a lot of you around here, which has been an issue for like a decade at this point, but with the advent of Action Wrestling and some animosity there, it's getting too heavy to ignore. Mainly Twitter, sometimes RPs, but we're all better than OOC potshots for the sake of it. For the record, I'm not the type to fill IT threads full of pot shots. Not so long ago, I was approached on AW boards by Crow/Rabid with a storm of meta gaming IT tweets, the bulk of which were "You're actually a white guy" memes meant to lure me into accepting a match at One, I guess? I had what I felt was a healthy conversation where I turned the match down. People close to me asked me if I was "working" the general community as he had apparently told WCF management that I was indeed in on it and we were working the community. This was after I turned down the challenge in PM saying that I had no interest in taking a WCF match of any sort. I let it be known then that I wasn't interested and it doesn't make sense to me that I'm once again hit with another wave of posts meant to provoke me with lame meta stuff. I get hit with really meta/4th wall break shots that are in no way the kind of things that would ever push kayfabe and as long as that happens, I'll say my piece within the border of the in character realm, but I don't wish to continue the back and forth forever. It's stupid. Good on CD to encourage that people actually use kayfabe. Still don't care for how this fed operates or what it is okay with endorsing. Still don't want a match. If you hear I'm in on a work, I'm not. Hopefully there's not a third installment of "Let's try to lure Spencer Adams with dumb meta shtuff." Anyways, have a good day. Maybe this gets deleted, maybe locked, maybe I just get banned or something. I don't know, just giving my side and how I feel on the matter. |
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John Rabid
Mid-Carder
My new book, "How To Manage A World Champion", out Oct 12th. Twitch Prime!
Posts: 521
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Post by John Rabid on Jan 29, 2019 0:08:59 GMT -5
The recent posts were done in conjunction with the angle Jared was working at the time over in AW, prior to your recent Revolution match. It wasn't meant as a resurrection of an angle you didn't want. Just a harmless, stupid rib (which as you know is very #beachkrew) and some hype for your match. That's all.
I never told management that our match was on after you declined it. You have your timeline confused there, my friend. That's not how I roll.
Congratulations on being the AW world champion, recognition for your hard work and dedication over the years both here and in UCI should be celebrated.
Also, it wasn't meant to be a 4th wall break, just an observation that your pic base here is still Finn Balor. Which was the point. Not because you are white.
No hard feelings dude.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 29, 2019 0:51:16 GMT -5
The recent posts were done in conjunction with the angle Jared was working at the time over in AW, prior to your recent Revolution match. It wasn't meant as a resurrection of an angle you didn't want. Just a harmless, stupid rib (which as you know is very #beachkrew) and some hype for your match. That's all. I never told management that our match was on after you declined it. You have your timeline confused there, my friend. That's not how I roll. Congratulations on being the AW world champion, recognition for your hard work and dedication over the years both here and in UCI should be celebrated. Also, it wasn't meant to be a 4th wall break, just an observation that your pic base here is still Finn Balor. Which was the point. Not because you are white. No hard feelings dude. Harmless ribbing is fine, it just felt excessive and a little baiting to me. If you say you never told management that, then fine. You're a fine writer. That's why what I felt were meta potshots were silly. I didn't feel you needed to resort to meta stuff. You say you weren't okay. However, I'm not saying "these are shots at me, Jordan, a white guy" it was "You have a white pb in WCF, a black one in AW." You're right, that's how a thing. Of course, I haven't been active enough to fuck with my signatures or archived roster entry in WCF. The meme is "Spencer Adams is white, not black" and it just feels like there's no point to it. The way the character is written has nothing to do with who I've chosen as a picbase at different points in time. I'm not furious over the meme of it, I'm just a little hurt that people who say they respect me ride what is 100% a 4th wall breaking meme as I feel it doesn't bring forth anything productive from an In Character perspective and it feels like it's an attempt to sell me short as a creator/contributor in this hobby when all that my writing is is me having fun and writing my stories. I'm not seeking hard feelings either. I just hope that it's not the intention of people who say they respect me to no sell me on the little things like that. I can put it behind me, let's just remember there's a healthier way to play this desktop tabletop game of sorts. |
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John Rabid
Mid-Carder
My new book, "How To Manage A World Champion", out Oct 12th. Twitch Prime!
Posts: 521
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Post by John Rabid on Jan 29, 2019 1:03:22 GMT -5
The recent posts were done in conjunction with the angle Jared was working at the time over in AW, prior to your recent Revolution match. It wasn't meant as a resurrection of an angle you didn't want. Just a harmless, stupid rib (which as you know is very #beachkrew) and some hype for your match. That's all. I never told management that our match was on after you declined it. You have your timeline confused there, my friend. That's not how I roll. Congratulations on being the AW world champion, recognition for your hard work and dedication over the years both here and in UCI should be celebrated. Also, it wasn't meant to be a 4th wall break, just an observation that your pic base here is still Finn Balor. Which was the point. Not because you are white. No hard feelings dude. Harmless ribbing is fine, it just felt excessive and a little baiting to me. If you say you never told management that, then fine. You're a fine writer. That's why what I felt were meta potshots were silly. I didn't feel you needed to resort to meta stuff. You say you weren't okay. However, I'm not saying "these are shots at me, Jordan, a white guy" it was "You have a white pb in WCF, a black one in AW." You're right, that's how a thing. Of course, I haven't been active enough to fuck with my signatures or archived roster entry in WCF. The meme is "Spencer Adams is white, not black" and it just feels like there's no point to it. The way the character is written has nothing to do with who I've chosen as a picbase at different points in time. I'm not furious over the meme of it, I'm just a little hurt that people who say they respect me ride what is 100% a 4th wall breaking meme as I feel it doesn't bring forth anything productive from an In Character perspective and it feels like it's an attempt to sell me short as a creator/contributor in this hobby when all that my writing is is me having fun and writing my stories. I'm not seeking hard feelings either. I just hope that it's not the intention of people who say they respect me to no sell me on the little things like that. I can put it behind me, let's just remember there's a healthier way to play this desktop tabletop game of sorts. The ingredient that's important to remember here is that it's John Rabid making these posts, and not me. It's very #beachkrew to act stupid and immature. The posts are not so much a jibe on how you run Spencer Adams, but rather a reflection of the frat mentality of #beachkrew. In essence that's the point. As a former member of #beachkrew (you also run Andre Aquarius) I thought you'd be receptive to that. Clearly that was a miscalculation on my part. Once again, no hard feelings. |
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